Advice please

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Right guys need to pick a few brains, a couple of years ago i did an old cottage for a friend of mine, it was the first time id used Lime but it turned out ok.

A developer i do properties for has now bought the cottage next door, his plan is to do it up and sell on for a profit.

Hes got Heritage involved as its grade two listed. 90 % of the upstairs has been skimmed with Multi finish at some point, and the chick that has been out told him it will be ok to over-skim as its already been done, Any walls that are Lime she wants over-skimming in Lime.

Downstairs at some point has been injected for damp, inside has been done in s&c upto 1.2m then patched with finish, outside has been re-pointed with s&c. She wants me to over-skim the downstairs with lime ! even though the bottom 1.2m is Thistle.

I understand the reasons behind the use of Lime in properties, and think to be done properly it should be hacked off and re done traditional, however hes not going to do that as he wont sell on for a profit.

His points are that damp Co have been out and are happy that there is no damp, outside is re-pointed / injected and inside skimmed, if it was to be over-skimmed with Lime surely this would just be for aesthetics as it wouldn't be able to do its job, Also as soon as he sells it the new owners will just paint it any way so it wont breath.

Hes arranged another meeting with this bird to try and convince her to let him over-skim it with thistle, whats the chance considering the work thats already been done has been done before hes bought it ?
 
Sounds like another example of conservation officers not really understanding the uses of traditional materials, and fixated with the use of lime in heritage work. It is important of course when beneficial to the building, but there is no practical benifit other than aesthetic to over skimming in lime on non permeable surfaces. Any bonding agent will kill breath ability any way, even dg27 has dubious breath ability properties!
Sounds like a good case to argue for a simple muti skim.
 
Ryan will be along soon to advise, Hicky.......................he's probably read up on this kind of work at some point
 
If she's insisting on lime, shouldn't she be insisting on hacking off the existing first :RpS_confused:
 
bubbles65 said:
If she's insisting on lime, shouldn't she be insisting on hacking off the existing first :RpS_confused:
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Exactly mate thats just it the Lime wont actually be doing anything surely. Also the damp injection, sand & cement pointing, and render and skim inside should probably not have been done, but there is now no damp and inside is solid so would it not be a shame to take this off if its working ? The developer has arranged a meeting for when im there and he wants me to speak to this chick, im thinking if he pushes his luck to much they might just tell him to strip it all out and go traditional. Will see what she says, i think shes a bit arty farty mate, keeps going on about lime as its a period material but im not sure she actually knows why it gets used.
 
Well you can get a onecoat lime that is suitable for plasterboards so I'm guessing that a 3mm coat of lime does have some benefits to the users of the building, if not the actual building. From a heritage point of view i.e. protecting the building, what she's proposing does fkall.
 
bubbles65 said:
Well you can get a onecoat lime that is suitable for plasterboards so I'm guessing that a 3mm coat of lime does have some benefits to the users of the building, if not the actual building. From a heritage point of view i.e. protecting the building, what she's proposing does fkall.
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The cottage that i did next door mate was an odd one, some of that had been boarded, Heritage made us put one coat of Multi on and trowel to a finish, then top it off with Lime, not sure how right or wrong that is but it worked well as the first coat of thistle had loads of moisture in so held the lime off nice, we've been next door since and its still there and looks well. Ill find some pics.

I think they just come up with their own ideas and methods ha ha
 
In my experience conservation officers are a bit like building inspectors and once they realise that you know what your doing and your not going to cut corners they tend to back off a bit and let you get on with it however you do get the odd one who likes to think they are right regardless of what you say. Basically you have to shmooze them a bit, if she dose get upset and start saying about strip back to stone just go the stud wall route which is a perfectly acceptable way to proceed on listed properties i'm gonna be doing this on a listed barn this year cos of the cost of lime and they want to insulate it to within an inch of it's life with 100mm kingspan between timbers and 80mm insulated boards on top of that !
 
raggles said:
In my experience conservation officers are a bit like building inspectors and once they realise that you know what your doing and your not going to cut corners they tend to back off a bit and let you get on with it however you do get the odd one who likes to think they are right regardless of what you say. Basically you have to shmooze them a bit, if she dose get upset and start saying about strip back to stone just go the stud wall route which is a perfectly acceptable way to proceed on listed properties i'm gonna be doing this on a listed barn this year cos of the cost of lime and they want to insulate it to within an inch of it's life with 100mm kingspan between timbers and 80mm insulated boards on top of that !
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Have you tried lime + hemp for an insulated system?
 
Yes mate, 1 coat of multi on to the boards troweled flat, then let it go just past the point of second coat timings then lay your lime on, theres plenty of moisture in your first coat still so the lime hangs all day. Was the first one that i had done so just went with the flow and did what they wanted.

The customer got the gear in, but off who i don't know, a firm Leicester way i think, it came sealed in bags and was quite firm we just knocked it up in buckets with clean water till it was spreadable. It was pretty fine but quite grainy if that makes any sense, it troweled up ok.
 
Don't know if it's the 'right' way or not mate ................... but if it's still on the walls and no obvious issues then who are we to argue :RpS_unsure:
It looks like fine stuff from them pics. A 50:50 mixture of lime and silica sand, lovely to use and better than throwing gypsum on every day :RpS_thumbup:

EDIT: I've only ever used FS out of tubs, not bags.
 
Yeah it was mega to spread mate. How do you usually finish it ?

I just put all the walls on as it hung for ages, troweled it as neat as it would go, then when it firmed right up misted the walls with clean water and troweled it again with the ss trowel, it produced like a really fine milky fat and finished alright.

Can you finish them with anything else other than ss trowels ? Plastics / sponge ?

Could you make your own gear with the Hydrated lime you used for rendering ? or do you need the putty that they slack ?
 
It doesn't need much water at all, if you're getting the fine milky fat I would suggest (cos I don't know for sure) that you're over-wetting it. It's finished to a matt finish and on a recent one I used a plastic/leathery trowel -from P1SS I think - and it produced a decent result. Looks good sponged too, in fact I preferred it sponge finished, lovely texture :RpS_thumbup:
 
You could make your own but the putty has to be 3 months matured I think :RpS_thumbup:
Can't see the point though when you can buy it readily matured and no need to take up you're own storage space.
 
bubbles65 said:
Have you tried lime + hemp for an insulated system?
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No marra i have not what are the costs like generally ? the barn i mention and the method was the customers choice not mine and the conservation officer is more than happy with it however, to keep them happy the customer is going to leave some of the internal walls bare stone and leaving what old lime plaster that is still on the wall intact "to make a feature of it and show the history" :rolleyes)
 
Hicky said:
Yeah it was mega to spread mate. How do you usually finish it ?

I just put all the walls on as it hung for ages, troweled it as neat as it would go, then when it firmed right up misted the walls with clean water and troweled it again with the ss trowel, it produced like a really fine milky fat and finished alright.

Can you finish them with anything else other than ss trowels ? Plastics / sponge ?

Could you make your own gear with the Hydrated lime you used for rendering ? or do you need the putty that they slack ?
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You can slake the lime your self but, much easier buying it cos you need to build a boiling pit and a storage area for the putty after you have boiled it (chemical reaction as it hits water) and as bubbles says it needs to mature for minimum 3 months.
 
We did a farm house last year. and all you got out of the customer was " I wanna keep the character of the building"....................:RpS_thumbup:
 
Lime skim can be made yourself if you really want to. Use either a putty/slaked lime or hydraulic. NOT hydrated lime. Use kiln dried sand as your aggregate. MIx usually 1:2 Lime to Sand or 1.5:1 which will create almost same texture as multi. Is cheaper to buy it though and just knock it up. PLenty of places sell it premixed so all you have to do is add some clean water nd knock up like normal. If you are getting white milky on the surface you are over wetting it. If you use a plastic trowel this will help as you dont need to wet the surface so reduces the risk of the lime on the surface.
 
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