Kingspan K5 external insulation board

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plasterjfe I spoke by telephone today with directors of the technical issues of two leading manufacturers of insulation systems in Europe and both have found that the installation of insulation only on the pins is faulty. Basic material is mounting adhesive, pins are the only additional protection.
Adhesive is used not only to stick the boards but also to the proper settings for insulation (H, V) and the protection insulated from air (oxidation). Each insulation system must be made according to the manufacturer, otherwise you lose your warranty.
If you know of any system installed only on the pin, give me his name or manufacturer.
 
I wouldn't worry about a warranty if its a Weber system. I am claiming on their warranty and they just lie their way out of everything!
 
Weber has only a high price and not quality. I know better insulation systems manufacturers with which it works more than 15 years and never had problems.
 
Majestics said:
plasterjfe I spoke by telephone today with directors of the technical issues of two leading manufacturers of insulation systems in Europe and both have found that the installation of insulation only on the pins is faulty. Basic material is mounting adhesive, pins are the only additional protection.
Adhesive is used not only to stick the boards but also to the proper settings for insulation (H, V) and the protection insulated from air (oxidation). Each insulation system must be made according to the manufacturer, otherwise you lose your warranty.
If you know of any system installed only on the pin, give me his name or manufacturer.
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again you show your lack of experience and you have taken the word of a "technical person" who works for a company who you use the material of correct ? - when you use more systems you will see that some adhesives a far superior to others and the adhesive is the primary fix and the pins are a secondry fix but when you work with some other systems where adhesive is mainly for coating work you know that the pins are the primary fix and the adhesive only the secondry fix if adhesive is even specified at all.

stop referring to Europe aswell, this is Britain and here we have BS standards and research by insurance companies and NHBC will state that pin (mechanical) fix is their main spec and concern. They want pins because the research as shown in MOST cases that pins are generally a better fix than adhesive.

Would it interest you that I spoke with a technical manager from a worldwide manufacturer this morning and he told me that every technical manager will swear the earth to you that their system is the best and that other systems are sub standard and should not be used - You seem to only have experience with one system and you believe fully everything these guys tell you!

What I am trying to say is not all systems are the same and the spec should always be followed you will see with other systems. The system I use can be fixed only with adhesive as the adhesive is the best on the market - the strongest and the stickiest. we also pin fix.
I also know that alot of european systems have sub standard basecoat and I wouldnt touch them with a barge poll

you need to get out and use some other systems and speak with more technical guys from more companies you will then learn they are all liers and you have to take only the good knowledge from each of these guys and learn to know when they are trying to upsell their product by feeding you bulls1t

good day sir
 
I do not understand what's the difference between British and European, I thought that the UK is a member of Europe, but from what I write I start to conclude that perhaps I am wrong.
Second things insulation in the UK market are known from only a few years, if you think that it is sufficient experience. So what can you give me a guarantee that the pins are better than mounting adhesive. I asked you to name the manufacturer gave such a system of insulation. give a certificate that are not checked, unless considering that three years of experience is a sufficient period to be tested.
I is based on the insulation systems are made ​​more than 15 years on the European continent and the Scandinavian countries, and are proven systems. Buildings which I did several years ago in Germany look like they were done yesterday. So I recognize that these systems are very good. I carried out several insulation systems companies such as German Ceresit,Terranova by Austrian or Polish Aval and installation of any of these systemsis not that different.
You ask whether I would give 30-year guarantee?
These insulation systems are there for more than 15 years and are exposed to extreme weather conditions. In the winter frosts over 30 degrees in summer to plus 40 degrees. How far do you think stand in the localtemperate climate.I do not understand what you're nervous, the customer always chooses the best and good things and no matter whether they are British or German or Dutch. Otherwise, how do you explain that to me on the road most of the British car brand is German, and Japanese.
Have a nice day sir
 
One more thing, you gave certificaty insulation system. What thickness ofinsulation provides Certification for the building of brick, what for building of breeze block and how to building of stone ? Kingspan K5 external insulation board
I enclose a photo of insulation mounted on the pins broken by the wind
 
Majestics said:
I do not understand what's the difference between British and European, I thought that the UK is a member of Europe, but from what I write I start to conclude that perhaps I am wrong.
Second things insulation in the UK market are known from only a few years, if you think that it is sufficient experience. So what can you give me a guarantee that the pins are better than mounting adhesive. I asked you to name the manufacturer gave such a system of insulation. give a certificate that are not checked, unless considering that three years of experience is a sufficient period to be tested.
I is based on the insulation systems are made ​​more than 15 years on the European continent and the Scandinavian countries, and are proven systems. Buildings which I did several years ago in Germany look like they were done yesterday. So I recognize that these systems are very good. I carried out several insulation systems companies such as German Ceresit,Terranova by Austrian or Polish Aval and installation of any of these systemsis not that different.
You ask whether I would give 30-year guarantee?
These insulation systems are there for more than 15 years and are exposed to extreme weather conditions. In the winter frosts over 30 degrees in summer to plus 40 degrees. How far do you think stand in the localtemperate climate.I do not understand what you're nervous, the customer always chooses the best and good things and no matter whether they are British or German or Dutch. Otherwise, how do you explain that to me on the road most of the British car brand is German, and Japanese.
Have a nice day sir
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you say its only been in england a few years thats rubbish i did this type of work over 20 years ago
 
Again Majestics you have TOTALLY MISUNDERSTOOD what I am saying. I never said the systems were manufactured in the uk I said that the British Standard is the level of specification required for the systems to be installed and inj MOST cases the NHBC and mortgage insurance backers will want a system that is fixed by pins aswell as adhesive or at least pins.

Most of the sytems are from the continent or the states and dont be giving me any rubbish about insulation work in this country it has been available since the 1960'S its just becoming more popular over the last 15 years because of new building regs in Britain but you will probably ignore british building regs.

Read my posts correctly and understand them first before you start rattling on about jap cars or german engineering ffs.

One other thing, the photo you posted is not a system mounted on pins that has failed in the wind.
It is in fact a rail sytem with a cavity between the insulation and the substrate, the problem will most likely have been a poorly terminated closure or reveal end/abuttment that has allowed a wind force to get behind the cavity and rip the insulation of the holding tracks/rails it is a common failure on rail systems that have NOT been terminated correctly around openings or reveals/stops.

Before you ask me "what the dots in the middle of the boards are then" NO they aint pins they are blobs of gun foam used on the square boards to give extra rigidity on the rail systems to avoid flexing,

So who does not have the experiencce?? like I said before you put information on a forum for sharing knowledge, make sure the info is right first
 
Look Majestic

I can see that you are passionate about what you do and I like that, fair play but you cant just shout EWI bible when some of the info is wrong. I will do a deal with you next time we fit a thermal system in cumbria that has a pin only spec I will have you on and you can do the job with us and you can take all the spec sheets and data literature away with you for keepsake. simple I cant say any fair than that,

I aint arguing with you no more about it mate.

full stop the end.
 
plasterjfe said:
Look Majestic

I can see that you are passionate about what you do and I like that, fair play but you cant just shout EWI bible when some of the info is wrong. I will do a deal with you next time we fit a thermal system in cumbria that has a pin only spec I will have you on and you can do the job with us and you can take all the spec sheets and data literature away with you for keepsake. simple I cant say any fair than that,

I aint arguing with you no more about it mate.

full stop the end.
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Think the problem is the language barrier John, no foooker can understand you:RpS_w00t:
 
I see that you know well on what you do and I have to respect. It is nice to lead a discussion with someone like you. Through this discussion, you can compare the different ways of performing insulation systems and learn something new. I would be very grateful if I could see your method of installation of insulation system in return I can provide you with documentation of my installation of insulation systems If you are interested in that. At the end I only have two questions. What is the cost of the material to 100 sq. meters of insulation and what render you using for insulation, thin layer or some other .
 
Majestics said:
I see that you know well on what you do and I have to respect. It is nice to lead a discussion with someone like you. Through this discussion, you can compare the different ways of performing insulation systems and learn something new. I would be very grateful if I could see your method of installation of insulation system in return I can provide you with documentation of my installation of insulation systems If you are interested in that. At the end I only have two questions. What is the cost of the material to 100 sq. meters of insulation and what render you using for insulation, thin layer or some other .
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AS spunky says mate I dont disclose cost materials or labour on here on here. but would have no problem talking with you about this in person if we do a job together

We use different insulation systems and they all have different thickness basecoats, the best adhesive basecoats with mesh can go as thin as 2 or 3mm and you can still bend it and it will not crack but other basecoats with less polymer and more cement mortar are usually the thicker ones around 8mm and will last out well on a flat wall but not anywhere near as flexible as some I use and will not bend.

I dont always get the chance to specify the products because most of our work is specified by the architect So we have to fit what they say.

I will come and have a look at your system anytime and my offer also stands of course.
 
plasterjfe said:
AS spunky says mate I dont disclose cost materials or labour on here on here. but would have no problem talking with you about this in person if we do a job together

We use different insulation systems and they all have different thickness basecoats, the best adhesive basecoats with mesh can go as thin as 2 or 3mm and you can still bend it and it will not crack but other basecoats with less polymer and more cement mortar are usually the thicker ones around 8mm and will last out well on a flat wall but not anywhere near as flexible as some I use and will not bend.

I dont always get the chance to specify the products because most of our work is specified by the architect So we have to fit what they say.

I will come and have a look at your system anytime and my offer also stands of course.
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And i will come and interpret for him J
 
warriorupnorth said:
bit like my wallcrete training today, lot of blank looks, especially from the Scottish lads, think they thought i was talkin Martian Andy
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I'm back up in Rotherham in three weeks time, usually takes a few hours to tune back in. Until then it's "yeah yeah, er na" and just hope it's the right answer lol
 
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Rigsby said:
What you doing in Rotherham Andy?
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My wife was born in Maltby and she has a big family around Rotherham and a few around York, and twice a year they hire a hall and have an afternoon family party. My wife wont be going to this one so once the gathering in the afternoon is done I'll probably find a nice pub with a selection of real ales to sample. The Fat Cat in Sheffield was good last time. hic.
 
plasterjfe said:
come off it mate I have done bungalows with 200M2 on them its 2 days work for a decent gang, if he knows what he is doing he will sort it quicktime no probs.

......and the fix (pin,adhesive or both) depends on the system manufacturer (there are loads of them out there now) and the spec
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thats what i like to here thats why im off to Dubai to teach them how proper applicators work...
 
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