Lime render advise please.

M

MUFC

New Member
Hi

First ever post on here so hopeful I won't get abused as I'm just after some helpful advise if possible. Basically been plastering for 15 years now mainly internal with maybe 5 small s&c renders in a year however I have been asked to render a brick built extension using only sand and nhl3.5 and no beads. In short the extension adjoins a listed building and the conservation people have insisted the extension but be render ASAP using this system only. Based in Northampton and I don't know anyone this way who can do this type of work or is willing to try with me so basically just me and the lad have to do it. I've read many conflicting methods and ratios etc but if any experienced guys can advise I would it would be very much appreciated as I am really keen to do it well.
The method I've seen so far from my research online is 3:1 nhl3.5 with sharp sand. The brickwork is very flat so was thinking scratch coat then top floated coat and sponged up. As for external angles can't decide if to use timber baton and remove after or external angle trowel.

Appreciate any good advise.

Thanks
 
Just knock the lime up first , the add the sand a little hair in the scratch coat helps . Just use a wooden rule ti foam the corners . And float finish we wooded use a sponge on lime
 
be careful this time of the year - water,water an water again.suction can kill you. For the external angles you are better of with baton, make sure is wet or use tape, long level , ruler etc. External trowel won't give you that sharp edge
 
vfr12 said:
be careful this time of the year - water,water an water again.suction can kill you. For the external angles you are better of with baton, make sure is wet or use tape, long level , ruler etc. External trowel won't give you that sharp edge
Click to expand...
I'm using parex heritage lime range at the minute
No need to soak the background and no going back to babysit the walls after application
Spraying lime render is so much easier then hand balling that s**t
 
Thanks guys nice to see genuine advise. Very different opinions it seems but starting to think I may swerve this one.

Thanks
 
Orangemachineman said:
I'm using parex heritage lime range at the minute
No need to soak the background and no going back to babysit the walls after application
Spraying lime render is so much easier then hand balling that s**t
Click to expand...
No need to do that ,no need to do this ,re invent the wheel ha ha .But need to go back when failed
 
Hi if its a new build and your not using bell beads you will bridge the damp corse and the job will get damp problems. Also new bricks/blocks will absorb lime compared to old which will cause crazing . I do historical lime work most days and only used pre mixed motar due to stone content in the sand mixing with nhl lime is difficult to judge. Hope this helps
 
seanlar said:
No need to do that ,no need to do this ,re invent the wheel ha ha .But need to go back when failed
Click to expand...
These renders are the way forward in my opinion
Impossible to get the mixes wrong.
Standing there watching the lime render go round in the mixer for 10 minutes,no thanks
 
Why are people so against new methods? People seem to slate bagged products and they haven't even tried them!
Don't forget this 'tried and tested' traditional ways weren't always traditional....they were also new at one point!



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Yeh one thousand years ago lol. I wasn't slateing them just wondered what he is using and where. I am interested that's all, working on the basis if it aint broke don't mend it. We are talking about a product that was used on the coliseum ( and before) and ever since, can you think of a system that's stood the test time like lime plastering?? I am not knocking orangemachineman I just would like to see what job he is working on and how it looks. A natural product hand applied has a texture and feel to it,that I think , you can not reproduce with modern products applied in a different manner. Do you see my point jgreenplastering??? In this job we are always learning - don't you agree ? In the next few months we are doing a lime render to a garden wall in Suffolk we have got to do some pargeting work lions, Griffins, etc haven't got a clue on the mix for the pargeting??? I was going to ask senlar. This site can be confrontational but if we help each other with advice it would be a lot better, I am not going to share commercially sensitive information like prices and rates but methods and spec is different, there does seem to be a pissing contest going on with certain members but people like pug and senlar seem to be of the same mind as me. I do not see anything wrong with doing a traditional lime plastering system in the traditional way
 
I will take pictures no worries
It's parex parlumiere lime render which is a fairly well known product
Very easy to spray and rule and a number of finished can be achieved with a float,scraped or trowel finish.
It's just a lot easier to use.its almost a self hydrating render so no f**k**g about wetting it down every night.im by no means a lime specialist but do 3/4 big jobs a year
 
stokeplasterer said:
Yeh one thousand years ago lol. I wasn't slateing them just wondered what he is using and where. I am interested that's all, working on the basis if it aint broke don't mend it. We are talking about a product that was used on the coliseum ( and before) and ever since, can you think of a system that's stood the test time like lime plastering?? I am not knocking orangemachineman I just would like to see what job he is working on and how it looks. A natural product hand applied has a texture and feel to it,that I think , you can not reproduce with modern products applied in a different manner. Do you see my point jgreenplastering??? In this job we are always learning - don't you agree ? In the next few months we are doing a lime render to a garden wall in Suffolk we have got to do some pargeting work lions, Griffins, etc haven't got a clue on the mix for the pargeting??? I was going to ask senlar. This site can be confrontational but if we help each other with advice it would be a lot better, I am not going to share commercially sensitive information like prices and rates but methods and spec is different, there does seem to be a pissing contest going on with certain members but people like pug and senlar seem to be of the same mind as me. I do not see anything wrong with doing a traditional lime plastering system in the traditional way
Click to expand...
Nor do I.each to there own with what materials they use
 
stokeplasterer said:
Yeh one thousand years ago lol. I wasn't slateing them just wondered what he is using and where. I am interested that's all, working on the basis if it aint broke don't mend it. We are talking about a product that was used on the coliseum ( and before) and ever since, can you think of a system that's stood the test time like lime plastering?? I am not knocking orangemachineman I just would like to see what job he is working on and how it looks. A natural product hand applied has a texture and feel to it,that I think , you can not reproduce with modern products applied in a different manner. Do you see my point jgreenplastering??? In this job we are always learning - don't you agree ? In the next few months we are doing a lime render to a garden wall in Suffolk we have got to do some pargeting work lions, Griffins, etc haven't got a clue on the mix for the pargeting??? I was going to ask senlar. This site can be confrontational but if we help each other with advice it would be a lot better, I am not going to share commercially sensitive information like prices and rates but methods and spec is different, there does seem to be a pissing contest going on with certain members but people like pug and senlar seem to be of the same mind as me. I do not see anything wrong with doing a traditional lime plastering system in the traditional way
Click to expand...

1,000 years ago it was still new though wasn't it.
Your totally missing my point mate. The OP stated he doesn't do this sort of work, now for ease of use a pre mixed bagged lime render seems a no brainer. This will make using lime a whole lot easier in my eyes.

I take my hat off to the plasterers who can work with lime on conservation and heritage projects, it truly is a skill in its own right, unfortunately I never learnt how to with my first boss and haven't had chance to since.

But another point to consider.....these modern bagged renders whether lime or cement based are not actually new like people think. They are pretty much the same as the traditional method except it comes pre mixed for you and you just add water! To me it couldn't get any easier, the mixes are consistent every time and you even had new products people didn't/don't think we're possible to use.

People are happy to go from a box tv to a HD tv to a 4K tv.
A brick phone to a smartphone.
From petrol cars to electric.
These are just the quickest things that spring to mind.

Construction materials have changed, it's all about moving forward, not sticking in the past.

People just need to be more open minded and willing to try new things that's all I think.



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MUFC said:
Hi

First ever post on here so hopeful I won't get abused as I'm just after some helpful advise if possible. Basically been plastering for 15 years now mainly internal with maybe 5 small s&c renders in a year however I have been asked to render a brick built extension using only sand and nhl3.5 and no beads. In short the extension adjoins a listed building and the conservation people have insisted the extension but be render ASAP using this system only. Based in Northampton and I don't know anyone this way who can do this type of work or is willing to try with me so basically just me and the lad have to do it. I've read many conflicting methods and ratios etc but if any experienced guys can advise I would it would be very much appreciated as I am really keen to do it well.
The method I've seen so far from my research online is 3:1 nhl3.5 with sharp sand. The brickwork is very flat so was thinking scratch coat then top floated coat and sponged up. As for external angles can't decide if to use timber baton and remove after or external angle trowel.

Appreciate any good advise.

Thanks
Click to expand...

Best to do a harling coat first before you scratch, this will even and suction and give you key for your scratch coat. 3-1 NHL 3.5, mix it up wet and harl with harling trowel, then follow on with you scratch and top coat. Make sure you get the right sand ask around local merchants. NHL lime mixes are easy, 3-1 is standard through all coats, make sure you give it a good mix. Protect from direct sunlight and lightly hydrate it, especially in the first 72 hours. NHL is quite forgiving.
 
stokeplasterer said:
And don't forget to use gloves and eye protection.
I agree with senlar and vfr12
Click to expand...

Especially glasses! In my early days we didn't had this. Will never forgot when I was mixing the stuff for my master jedi, got some of the lime in my eye. Didn't thought it's a big deal.About 10-15min later I couldn close my eye, red like hell and popped out like fried egg. The doctor wasn't sure if I will recover at all. 1h, 3L of eye wash solution and bandage for almost a month reminds me always to start with the glasses first , even before I had a look at th bags.
 
I have about 30m2 of pointing to do next week in lime.

Can I just mix NHL 3.5 at 3:1 with regular yellow building sand and point as I would with a cement mix? Never used it before.


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carlos said:
I have about 30m2 of pointing to do next week in lime.

Can I just mix NHL 3.5 at 3:1 with regular yellow building sand and point as I would with a cement mix? Never used it before.


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Click to expand...

Depends what's the wall and size of the pointing joists. Is it high porosity or low. In generally the mix for , let's say 10mm joist , is 1:2.5. For nhl 2 is 1:2; nhl5 is 1:3 . For biger joist up to 20mm -1:3. The mix should be sticky to be able to push it back as far as you can with the pointing tool. Make sure is compressed well but don't go too much over it or you will create hard crust which will basically reduce dramatically the benefits of lime. To avoid this tap the joist with hard brush, especially if they are deep and finish it with piece of wood , which will give you an open surface and will reduce the cracking. I personaly prefer coarse sand for the reasons above. Asking for the mix , I will take it you know about the preparation .
That was question for the beginners .

How do you prepare tripe and intestines with lime putty for cooking?
To the lime masons .......
 
It's a 9" solid brick barn. 10mm ish joints I'm going to grind out.

As for the porosity, I've no idea I would say medium suction if I were to be rendering it.

I've no spec to follow and when I asked for 1 was told to just get on with it. The client seems to think the conservation bloke at the council wants NHL 0.5. I'm not sure that's even a real thing!



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I guess the brick work is soft then. It's premixed and need water only no sand. Eliminates mistakes and you have consistent mix every time . He might ask you to do 20mm deep joist in two passes .
 
Hi Carlos i use ty mawr limes for pointing work the gear is great they color match if you need too. Have tryed all methods mixing my self and lots of other suppliers and these lot are miles ahead of the game hope this helps
 
carlos said:
It's a 9" solid brick barn. 10mm ish joints I'm going to grind out.

As for the porosity, I've no idea I would say medium suction if I were to be rendering it.

I've no spec to follow and when I asked for 1 was told to just get on with it. The client seems to think the conservation bloke at the council wants NHL 0.5. I'm not sure that's even a real thing!



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Click to expand...
nah its not.
 
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