Newbie saying hello, and tale of two walls.

[BNJ]

Hello people,

Nice site Danny, top stuff. Two fingers to the screwfix (or is that a swearword here?) forums for not having a plasterers only forum hey. Had a read of the forum over the last couple of days and been well impressed with the attitude and willingness of you guys to help others out.

Decided to dive in and do a bit of plastering on my Victorian Terrace, plenty of work to do as you can imagine, and always wanted to have a crack at it. Been tackling bits on my stairwell and upstairs hallway, big respect to you spreads.

Anyways, here's what I've done so far. External corner at the top of the stairs, beaded and then skimmed and feathered in to about a metre in from the bead. This came out a treat but anthing I've done since has been OK'ish but nowhere near as good. Skimmed a whole wall that was very rough and not worth filling. All looked good until it dried out to reveal a couple of waves that Keanue Reevs could have jumped on top of. Where did I go wrong? When I went at it after laying it on all looked fine, certainly wasn't obvious that I had these waves. Here's what I did:
Area approx 3mx4m (PVA'd twice) Layed on first coat, took about 15mins (don't laugh). Came back and trowelled this off but wasn't overly fussy, just got the lines out (was this where I went wrong?, should I have got this perfect?) best I could. Then mixed up about half as much again and laid on again. Same 15mins give or take. Then trowelled this off twice, the second time with the plaster being like plastercine in consistency. I did realise some slight bumps and the trowelling was difficult, but the waves I describe were on a part of the wall that I thought was pretty much spot on. I then gave it a wet trowel with plenty of pressure and that was all I did. Reasonably pleased with the results but will be needing to fill or sand to get rid of Keaneu.

Anyway, if you got this far, thanks for reading.

John

p.s. Gonna post my top don'ts list in a couple of days: First item will be:

1) Don't let the back edge of the trowel get too close to the plaster, DOH! :-[

 

[Danny]

Welcome to theplasterers forum,

Have you got a photo of the waves? I am struggling to see what you mean.

Regards

Danny

 

[BNJ]

Hi Danny, sorry no photos sanded back now. Perhaps I exagerated a bit, but the 'waves' were a series of horizontal ripples caused no doubt as I trowelled upwards. Point is though to look at it wet it wasn't obvious at all. Only once dry with a mist coat on it. Think maybe I didn't trowel enough in other directions, i.e. up, down, 45 degrees, across. Does this make sense, could this have been the reason?

BNJ

 

[Rocky]

Not sure but by sounds of what you descibed sounds like when you are wet trowelling either your trowel got too dry or towards end of stroke you stopped applying enough pressure. As long as you catch it as you do it comes straight out!

 

[BNJ]

Hi Rocky,

Thannks for the reply, got a couple of small areas to go at this weekend so will bare that in mind.

Whilst on can anyone enlighten me to what 'rolling a gauge' means. Saw mention of this in a few posts.

Thanks
BNJ

 

[f_man]

i think what you are describing is otherwise known as tiger stripeing,this is due to getting on the walls just a tad too early also if you cross trowel when giving wet trowel this will help with walls looking alot better.

 

[Peg]

Best advise is don't play with the walls too much, get it on, trowel it up, ifs its ok, leave it alone for a while then get back on it, the more you try to play with it the worse it can look. If you've troweled it up an its looking rippley leave it until it tightens up. Then trowel it again.

Sometimes think if your trowel is new or not worn in enough this can cause major problems with your finish. The blade on ma finishing trowel just broke yesterday and i'm devestated, trying to break one in just now but its not the same!

 

[BNJ]

Cheers for the advice f man and peg. Sorry to hear about your trowl peg. :'(

 

[topmark]

Hi, I agree, were the ripples about 4-6mm in width? Sounds like you were trowelling up and either you were moving the trowel a tad too fast over the surface or It was at that stage of setting/drying which required clean water to act as lubricant on trowel/surface. Mark

 

[tomcat]

hey welcome to the forum mate.

i think i know the kind of bumps/lines your talking about i get this somtimes and its very annoying, hard to get rid of and if you dont know what your looking for hard to see also.

i guess you wil now know what your looking for? its hard to explain.
but if you do then try and trowl the wall the oposite way to the bumps, you might find the bumps just go that way also, if so then leave it untill its ready to trowl up with water then trowl it up, again they might stay there if so continue to trowl the wall up and finish it.
then give it a hard dry trowl after the oposite way to the bumps so it flattens.

this should sort it out always does with me, if not last result run the brush over it and run the trowl over it quite hard, this polishes it up though so avoid it if you can.

good luck.

 

[daveparkinson]

i'm trying to break a new trowel in as my best setting trowel went pissed on me.I have been getting this striping as well but mainly at the bottom .I've put it down to the trowel as it wasn't happening with the old one!As previous posts said if you leave it a while then trowel with water they do go.I do find it strange though as you can feel a slight ridge in the stripe which won't fill up with a trowel that's straight!

 

[BNJ]

Cheers for the tips Tomcat, Daveparkinson

I've done two small walls and a ceiling since. Still had some waves but not as pronounced as last time. Defo thnk it's partly my trowl (new) and also my technique. Cross troweling has definitely helped me, also think that due to my slow pace that any problems become amplified as I'm fighting the clock all the time.

Really enjoying it though, well most of it anyway. The neck ache, shouler ache, dry hands, wet boot, hunger pains take some getting used to though. :'(

I've applied alot of the suggestions from these pages so thanks to all posters for the valuable tips.

BNJ

 

[bigsegs]

this tiger striping, i seen a lot of people gettin it and completely ignoring it...
i put it down to a combination of things based on what i seen other people doin and compared to what i try and do to avoid it and get it 'all one colour' although in reality i still get small amounts of it regular...
1) toppin with same mix, seen people doin this regular, seems to stripe every time, as it does for me
2) toppin too thinly, you end up draggin the toppin off in places as you trowel up..
3) too steep on the trowel angle as you flatten, you end up pullin the toppin off again

what i try and do for a perfect wall when im in a philosophical 'lets see how good i can get this one' sort of mood...
lets say for example 4m linear 2.4 high 1 wall all on its lonesome...
knock up bout a full bag, maybe 3/4, quite thick, will pretty much stay on the hawk upside down (ish) should feel quite sticky..
lay it on flattenin as you go, wash tools, clean edges and flatten again properly
let that pull so the colour changes slightly or it feels almost dry to the trowel, just not quite 1st trowel dry
mix up again. bout 1/3rd bag, slightly wetter than 1st coat
lay on, flattenin as you go BUT not too thin as say 'top a wall with a hawkfull', the trowel should glide over the first coat and no dry spots, should leave layin on lines
clean tools, clean edges and flatten..BUT...
when flattenin keep the trowel flat and PUSH it into the wall get that wall FLAT
keep doin that 2nd time, the colour is changin as your trowelin it now, every time you sweep you leave behind a slightly lighter colour NOW THEN...
this is when the stripes will appear if your not careful...
KEEP THAT BACK EDGE CLEAN!!!!
an 11" as opposed to a 14" or bigger will really help you here, if you get a stripey bit, sweep the same bit again really flat angle, more pressure, the swept area should be one colour, width of trowel, not stripey and no lines
you shouldnt be pullin any off the wall, you should just have a thin line of skim along the inside edge of your trowel thats fillin in for you, if youve put too much on itll come off as you go, get rid of it on the side of the bucket, you shouldnt really need it on there...you can use it for scabs and drags of course...
keep goin till end of wall
repeat
if youve done it correctly you should be left with a perfect wall, all one colour, finished BEFORE you got dark spots
if you wanna polish it let it go RIGHT off i.e. right on the turn almost dark all over, thing is itll all go at once then water it and pick your edge up..
should mention i use very little water at all (up to polish or a bits gone quick), none on the wall itself, just a thin brush line to clean up the edges and this is multi finish on any surface...
by all means water it if its gone too dry but try to keep it too a minimum, let the trowel and your arm do the work...

i never been to plastering school, i learnt from loads of other people some 1 coat, some top with same mix, some mix up like p**s, some mix up like cottage cheese, some put it on then pull most of it back off again????? (wots all that about :-?)
best tip i ever got was 'mix up again for toppin', improved my final finish no end, specially on a big set...
this however is just what works for me, i dont think ive ever (no bullshit) seen two plasterers work exactly the same way....

been workin with an italian recently... no hawk, just loads a 2 foot 2 handed trowel to lay on with straight out the bucket, then trowels up with a 9", mad as a box of frogs but by god hes fast...

i also seen people manage it in one coat too...arms like my legs....

 

[BNJ]

Nice one Segs,
thanks.

BNJ

 

[dpbeds]

Hi Rocky,

Thannks for the reply, got a couple of small areas to go at this weekend so will bare that in mind.

Whilst on can anyone enlighten me to what 'rolling a gauge' means. Saw mention of this in a few posts.

Thanks
BNJ

Thought I'd answer the second bit.
A rolling gauge is a syatem of laying on in that allows you to huge areas.
Goes like this
Imagine you have a wall about 100m long (it doesn't matter just too long to do in one hit)
Mix up a half gauge of plaster and lay on the first coat. section 1
Mix up a full gauge and flatten off section 1 then apply new mix over section 1 and go ont next bit laying on first coat. Section 2
Next gauge lay on second coat to section 2 and first to next section. section 3
Now first wet trowel section 1 and second coat section 3 and first coat new bit. section 4.
Second trowel section 1 first trowel section 2 flatten section 3
section 1 should now be about finished and your moving to second coat section 5 first coat section 6 second trowel section 2 and first trowel section 3 and flatten section etc etc etc
it means your always laying onto a wet edge.

or something lke that!
It's easier to demonstrate!!

 

[BNJ]

Thanks dpbeds,

Cystal clear that explanation. Sounds like I could employ that technique on my next couple of ceilings. Was really struggling with my last ceiling and ran out of steam strying to get all the lines out.

This'll make you laugh btw. Had a mate help me out when I did it, about 4mx4m. We got the remnants of the old artex cleaned off, I then asked him to PVA the ceiling with 3/1 mix. When I went to test the pva to see if i was tacky a bubble formed as I pulled my finger away. Turns out he'd mixed it 3 PVA to 1 water. :-[ Took over an hour and half to scrub it up and get it watered down. That didn't help with the energy levels when it was time to actually get the plaster on.

BNJ

 

[dpbeds]

lol
Funny the things we take for granted innit?

I used to find ceilings hard work until I started using WBA and got some stilts.
They are great!!!!!

BTW Don't use the rolling gauge unless you have to. 4x4 should go on in one really.
Rolling gauge on small areas gets confusing!