PhilPlaster
Private Member
I know its not practice and ive heard of the guy from birmingham but has anyone ever dot n dabbed tiles?
tiling!!!!
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rockhardsolidplastering
Active Member
bond it or wba and go for it
ajplastering
Member
I ONLY TILE USING TRAVERTINE, LIMESTONE, MARBLE AND GRANITE AS IND CERAMIC TILING BORING SO I ALWAYS PUT A FULL BED ON THE WALL
Chris W
Well-Known Member
never ever dot and dab tiles.. if you find you have to then you havent prepped the wall correctly in the first place..
thats why the plasterers get a slagging if a bathroom wall aint flat...
most of the premixed wall tile adhesive just wont set when its on anything over about 8mil anyway.. you need to use bagged powdered mix it yourself cement based stuff really..
and wickes have changed their stock premixed adhesive from what was actually a half decent product to what is now an acrylic product thats absolute f'cking sh'te...
thats why the plasterers get a slagging if a bathroom wall aint flat...
most of the premixed wall tile adhesive just wont set when its on anything over about 8mil anyway.. you need to use bagged powdered mix it yourself cement based stuff really..
and wickes have changed their stock premixed adhesive from what was actually a half decent product to what is now an acrylic product thats absolute f'cking sh'te...
RainbowThistlePlastering
New Member
PhilPlaster said:
Hope you've got the proper Quals to do tiling phil. And the CSCS card to go with it ;D
Dot and dabbing is the old way of tiling - if you have every knocked off old tiles you might have seen 5 spots of adhesive - 1 on each corner and one in the middle - the trend now is the pre-mixed adhesive and a serated trowel - probably because its quicker - but using this method tilers won't get over anything - if it aint perfectly flat and plumb they don't wanna know - I guess with the old method you could get over more if you know where they high spots are.
PhilPlaster
Private Member
Its not for a job lads. I hate tiling so choose not to do it.
Its for a floor in my house, small utility room. But theres an area on timber floor about one n half ft square that got a bow in it. About 1/4 inch.
Its for a floor in my house, small utility room. But theres an area on timber floor about one n half ft square that got a bow in it. About 1/4 inch.
Chris W
Well-Known Member
shouldve said that first mate...
1) dont even think about dot and dabbing floor tiles, 1 dropped mug and its cracked...
2) tiling on timber is dodgy.... that premixed 'flexible tile adhesive' wont go off over aboput 3mm thick and the way to use that is only ever on a chipboard floor, flat as, pva a metre, spread straight onto wet pva usning a wall trowel...
if you need a bit of depth use a powdered flexible adhesive or get some flexi additive and make sure the floor is dead sound and movement free... the flexibility in the adhesive only allows for the natural movement of the timber, not a bouncy floor...
i'd be thinking off ripping it up and replacing with new chipboard to be honest...
1) dont even think about dot and dabbing floor tiles, 1 dropped mug and its cracked...
2) tiling on timber is dodgy.... that premixed 'flexible tile adhesive' wont go off over aboput 3mm thick and the way to use that is only ever on a chipboard floor, flat as, pva a metre, spread straight onto wet pva usning a wall trowel...
if you need a bit of depth use a powdered flexible adhesive or get some flexi additive and make sure the floor is dead sound and movement free... the flexibility in the adhesive only allows for the natural movement of the timber, not a bouncy floor...
i'd be thinking off ripping it up and replacing with new chipboard to be honest...
The problem with dotting and dabbing tiles is that the tile is not fully supported at all points and therefore wants to bend - tiles dont like bending! :
If the floor was masonry then latex would be the answer but because the floor is wooden it makes it more difficult - you may find a latex that is designed for wood or maybe use PVA/SBR - after all latex is cement based. You may? get away with putting the adhesive on much thicker but modern adhesives take a long time to dry out. The gold standard would be to use something like hardibacker - a cementous board not unlike plasterboard - especially designed for tiling over. You could then dot and dab the hardibacker with something like pink grip - a bit like drylining a floor. Another more drastic solution would be taking up the boards and planing/packing the timbers.
If the floor was masonry then latex would be the answer but because the floor is wooden it makes it more difficult - you may find a latex that is designed for wood or maybe use PVA/SBR - after all latex is cement based. You may? get away with putting the adhesive on much thicker but modern adhesives take a long time to dry out. The gold standard would be to use something like hardibacker - a cementous board not unlike plasterboard - especially designed for tiling over. You could then dot and dab the hardibacker with something like pink grip - a bit like drylining a floor. Another more drastic solution would be taking up the boards and planing/packing the timbers.PhilPlaster
Private Member
If i have to I'll replace the floor etc but just for a quicker route was thinking of self leveler with grano mixed in for depth. What do you think?
Three things spring to mind:
will it take to the wooden floor?
are the joists man enough to take the weight of leveller and tile?
will it crack and lift the tiles due to natural movement of the floor?
I tiled my bathroom floor - for some reason best known to myself at the time went for hardboard over the floor boards then tiled - 3 years on I've noticed at the bounciest part of the floor the grout slowly cracks and disintegrates - now I have a created a routine maintenance job of having to replace the grout ever so often - wishing know I'd gone down the hardibacker route - hey ho - live and learn!
will it take to the wooden floor?
are the joists man enough to take the weight of leveller and tile?
will it crack and lift the tiles due to natural movement of the floor?
I tiled my bathroom floor - for some reason best known to myself at the time went for hardboard over the floor boards then tiled - 3 years on I've noticed at the bounciest part of the floor the grout slowly cracks and disintegrates - now I have a created a routine maintenance job of having to replace the grout ever so often - wishing know I'd gone down the hardibacker route - hey ho - live and learn!
Not sure that the advice is conflicting - both agree that tiling unveven floors is trick and both have suggested avenues to explore - without seeing the floor personally - it aint as easy as saying this is the best way to go - but take your point - as a bloke who's doing it day in day out - but I guess if you post to tiler forum you'll get the same "Conflicting" suggestions!lucius said:
PhilPlaster
Private Member
I knew the answer mate deep down before I started. Been on tiling forums...soz lads!, and they all say DOT N DAB BAD!! I really was lookin for someone to say yeh its cool Phil, do it and you'll have no problems. BUGGER!lucius said:
I'm gonna replace the floor. Do it once do it properly.
Cheers lads.
FreeD
Private Member
You can self level over timber floors...providing its all secure SBR it then go over with Mapei Fibreplan...then use 2 part flexible adhesive to fix tiles (topps is cheapest)
If replacing floor i'd go for WBP Ply....you may get away with 18mm in small room put with support where boards join i'd go for thicker if poss...then tile with standard flexible adgesive. If you use chipboard make sure you over board it with 6mm hardibackers and then use 2 part flexible adhesive.
If replacing floor i'd go for WBP Ply....you may get away with 18mm in small room put with support where boards join i'd go for thicker if poss...then tile with standard flexible adgesive. If you use chipboard make sure you over board it with 6mm hardibackers and then use 2 part flexible adhesive.
Chris W
Well-Known Member
theres 2 kinds of chipboard freed, theres non waterproof and waterproof (although its only water resistant) and it comes in 18 or 22mm..
but youre right in what youre saying.. though hardibacker is bloody expensive..
i was just offering the costs up and being a bit biast toward my way by going 18mm.. ;D
you can use waterproof flexible tile adhesive to level it up if it works out cheaper than latex but you need to make sure its the powdered stuff and not the premixed..
still easier and cheaper to rip it up though...
cant remember last time i got a sheet of wpb but i think it was around the 38 quid mark for an 8x4x19mm
but youre right in what youre saying.. though hardibacker is bloody expensive..
i was just offering the costs up and being a bit biast toward my way by going 18mm.. ;D
you can use waterproof flexible tile adhesive to level it up if it works out cheaper than latex but you need to make sure its the powdered stuff and not the premixed..
still easier and cheaper to rip it up though...
cant remember last time i got a sheet of wpb but i think it was around the 38 quid mark for an 8x4x19mm
FreeD
Private Member
Yea WBP is expensive...
good idea about levelling up with flexible tile adhesive...probably would work out cheaper if you use topps grey about £8 for 25kg...never thought of doing that although i do it on walls all the time!
On new builds I tend to overboard chipboard (the green water resistant one) with hardibacker 6mm...just for safety. But I have heard of people going straight over it with 2 part flexi e.g. Bal Fastflex...I'm always tempted to do it! Often in small new build bathrooms theres hardly any deflection...just some1 told me once that adhesive doesn't take to well to moisture resistant chipboard because of wax in the boards...but from my experience that 2 part flexi will stick to anything...I couldn't get it off my hands and ended up having to use petrol to get it off!
good idea about levelling up with flexible tile adhesive...probably would work out cheaper if you use topps grey about £8 for 25kg...never thought of doing that although i do it on walls all the time!
On new builds I tend to overboard chipboard (the green water resistant one) with hardibacker 6mm...just for safety. But I have heard of people going straight over it with 2 part flexi e.g. Bal Fastflex...I'm always tempted to do it! Often in small new build bathrooms theres hardly any deflection...just some1 told me once that adhesive doesn't take to well to moisture resistant chipboard because of wax in the boards...but from my experience that 2 part flexi will stick to anything...I couldn't get it off my hands and ended up having to use petrol to get it off!
PhilPlaster
Private Member
Once ive replaced the flooring mate I'm still gonna put down 6mm ply on top. Just to be safe.
Doin it Tues so I'll let you know how it went. Pity I'm not gettin paid for it!
Doin it Tues so I'll let you know how it went. Pity I'm not gettin paid for it!
Chris W
Well-Known Member
agreed the 6mm ply will do nothing... dont replace it with old floorboards, use proper flooring grade tongue and grooved chipboard, glued... plenty of good fixings...
if you do use old 5" floorboards then definately hardibacker it...
the feeling of job satisfaction youll get from a job well done will more than make up for the cash... and prolly get you a blowjob too ;D
if you do use old 5" floorboards then definately hardibacker it...
the feeling of job satisfaction youll get from a job well done will more than make up for the cash... and prolly get you a blowjob too ;D
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