spunky
Private Member
But how does it affect insurance if you're qualified or not surely if you do a bad job you get a retention held back
cscs card
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But how does it affect insurance if you're qualified or not surely if you do a bad job you get a retention held back
There is more chance of having an accident, causing an accident to the public or someone on site, damaging the whole job. not finishing it the list is endless if you used unqualified staff to do any type of job. The retention is there for a reason but not as a backup plan to start the job again.
essexandy
The Lake Governor
Well I for one really hope you're right on this one Flynny.
spunky
Private Member
Why is there more chance of having an accident? and as for the rest of it that's the contractors job it's got nothing to do with the main contractor
spunky
Private Member
Flynny I know of loads of rough plasterers that have got cscs cards, look at all the comments you get on here about how s**t some lads are on site
I've seen it for myself and I'm sure you have, the problem is they handed them out like sweets cost the government an absolute fortune and its got the construction industry absolutely nowhere
Do you really think plasterers are better today than they were 20-30 year ago regardless of qualifications what's you're thoughts?
I've seen it for myself and I'm sure you have, the problem is they handed them out like sweets cost the government an absolute fortune and its got the construction industry absolutely nowhere
Do you really think plasterers are better today than they were 20-30 year ago regardless of qualifications what's you're thoughts?
mark ross
Private Member
I could not agree more, some the best plasterers I have had on, have not had a single qualification to their name.Great spreads, with good work ethic are hard to find. When I have trained youngsters, the ones that excel are born naturals to the skills needed .An acedemic background will only strenthen a knowledge base, which although is key to undertsanding proscesses, it will never make any one a skillful tradesman where the core skills required are manual,not academeic.
I agree mate. I've been at it for 24 years and just re-newed
mine. It was supposed to get rid of the cowboys, it didn't.
Its just another money making con.
As for the NVQ2. For me a guy came out and took photos of me
boarding, skimming, dotting, roughing,rendering and screeding.
He filled the forms. I sighned them. He then said he got £600 for
everyone that passed. That was 10 years ago. Waste of time.
mine. It was supposed to get rid of the cowboys, it didn't.
Its just another money making con.
As for the NVQ2. For me a guy came out and took photos of me
boarding, skimming, dotting, roughing,rendering and screeding.
He filled the forms. I sighned them. He then said he got £600 for
everyone that passed. That was 10 years ago. Waste of time.
mark ross
Private Member
Thats is true, I guess my statement is also only made from my own experiences in the trade. I am sure there are plenty of very good spreads out there who have papers to boot. I just have not met or employed any.I am certainly not condoning any one who wishes to gain qualifications, and at the very least it shows a willingness to better yourself where your trade is concerned.
Its simple spunky if your using unqualified staff in any type of job there is more chance of something going wrong. The construction industry is the most dangerous industry to be in so if you have unqualified people on site there is more chance of an accident, surely you understand that. It doesnt matter how good you are and i agree it doesnt mean your a better spread but it means you are qualified to do it which will get you the start before a labourer.
I agree there are good and bad but the point is you need the card. They were given out willy nilly thats why a level 2 aint gonna do you any favours in the future also i dont think it cost the government anything did it? 20 years ago you had the ruff and the smooth but there wasnt 5 day courses about.
essexandy
The Lake Governor
I don't think he's saying it's being phased out just that they were and are so easy to get as to be meaningless.
Did anyone listen to radio one today? It was about the health and safety visiting refurbs or lets call it the domestic side of the game compared to site. There have been more deaths compared to when the boomn was on but mostly on refurbs. Im tellin ya and ive always said it the cscs is gonna come into the smaller jobs coz i recon there gonna need the same s**t they do on site ie H&S coz they will get a visit and big fines. The man in the street will be askin for it soon even if he is just after a reduction if you havent got it, maybe they will attach it to a cis type card and have it all in one?
Not to do skilled work on some sites.
I didnt say that, its become a bit of an easy qualification to gain which like you sadi easy to get so the standards are raised to level 3 in my opinion.
Labourers are employed to do labouring or lets call it unskilled work, if you had labourers doin the electrics there are gonna be problems.
Im not sure how there gonna monitor them but if a customer asks to see it, your not gonna get out of it and you can tell as many tales about all the jobs youve done over the last 20 years but if it says labourers card your gonna look a ****.
You cant pull figures out of the air lets be fair and say 20% level3, 40% level2, 40% labourers and the point of having level2 is its better than the labourers one. Didnt you have a labourers one then got the skilled one? Why did you do that?
spunky
Private Member
There's nothing stopping a s**t electrician with a skill card doing work or a s**t plumber or a plasterer because they got there card through a bit of paperwork a half hour site visit and a few photos because the company who dished out the card was more interested in getting as many people through as poss to claim there 900 quid
Then theres the poor bastards who didn't get funding and had to pay for it themselves .....it hasn't made a difference what was the point?
Site work, domestic work it doesn't matter it's the same scenario
I'm all for a health and safety card a million percent 30 quid brilliant saves lives makes people aware etc but the cscs card has failed it's pointless
Then theres the poor bastards who didn't get funding and had to pay for it themselves .....it hasn't made a difference what was the point?
Site work, domestic work it doesn't matter it's the same scenario
I'm all for a health and safety card a million percent 30 quid brilliant saves lives makes people aware etc but the cscs card has failed it's pointless
Thats all it is, is a H&S card with your skills on it mine cost me £30 and i sent off my quals, so if you havent got the quals to do the job your doing you need to get them.
There is a more qualified work force because of it.
spunky
Private Member
On paper only no one has been forced to go to college any more than 20 years ago
People are qualified based on a one day site visit, trust me I wanted it to work as much as you but it hasnt the proof is available to anyone who wants to walk onto a building site it's pointless
Plus the other frustrating thing is if you need a labourer for the odd day it's impossible and there getting harder and harder to get hold of because they don't have cscs cards or are just confused about how to go about it if anything it's made the industry go backwards because lads aren't learning properly
People are qualified based on a one day site visit, trust me I wanted it to work as much as you but it hasnt the proof is available to anyone who wants to walk onto a building site it's pointless
Plus the other frustrating thing is if you need a labourer for the odd day it's impossible and there getting harder and harder to get hold of because they don't have cscs cards or are just confused about how to go about it if anything it's made the industry go backwards because lads aren't learning properly
You can still go to college and learn properly but the point im making is you need it and if you havent got it your gonna be bolloxed like what your saying ie getting a lad on site for a day.
Only if your unqualified xxxxx
What learn how to plaster? Its been asked a 1000 times you know the score.
Get a labourers card or a trainee card as long as he is working with a skilled plasterer i doubt there would be a problem coz thats what they are for.
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