"That's the way we've always done it."

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I was thinking about the screed for the extension floor, and what a pointless waste of time and money it is. Screed has it's place, and is the only solution for some jobs, but it's used way too often and unnecessarily so IMHO.

The thing that makes it redundant in a lot of cases is bagged levelling compound which provides the finish for the floor covering to go down on.

If the concrete slab is poured and levelled and trowelled correctly, then 5mm of latex leveller to take out any pimples, dimples etc it's job done. Which is what I'm going to do in the extension.

That got me thinking about all the other times we do stuff just because that's always been the way. The building game is notoriously resistant to change. Materials technology is constantly advancing, and the new stuff does get used, but it tends to be as well as rather than instead of.
 
imago said:
I was thinking about the screed for the extension floor, and what a pointless waste of time and money it is. Screed has it's place, and is the only solution for some jobs, but it's used way too often and unnecessarily so IMHO.

The thing that makes it redundant in a lot of cases is bagged levelling compound which provides the finish for the floor covering to go down on.

If the concrete slab is poured and levelled and trowelled correctly, then 5mm of latex leveller to take out any pimples, dimples etc it's job done. Which is what I'm going to do in the extension.

That got me thinking about all the other times we do stuff just because that's always been the way. The building game is notoriously resistant to change. Materials technology is constantly advancing, and the new stuff does get used, but it tends to be as well as rather than instead of.
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Think it's Gettin it poured levelled n trowelled correctly is the problem, especially on bigger jobs. Half the bigger jobs you are lucky if its built right, Nvm sub floor done right lol.
 
JayJSF said:
I've always wondered why the concrete isn't just poured to correct height??


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For plumbers to fix their pipes after we finish? They are usually the next ones in after us on site anyways
 
All pipework is buried in the walls over here and every room where present has isolation taps so when working on bathrooms and kitchens your not effecting the rest of the property.
Also the electrics are run through conduit and junction boxes spread about to access and pull wires easily.
 
Simon85 said:
Think it's Gettin it poured levelled n trowelled correctly is the problem, especially on bigger jobs. Half the bigger jobs you are lucky if its built right, Nvm sub floor done right lol.
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I agree, and on sites it makes economic sense, over block and beam it's a necessity, but smaller extensions, refurb's or single house new builds with slab floors it's utterly pointless. Horses for courses.
 
A.plasterer said:
All pipework is buried in the walls over here and every room where present has isolation taps so when working on bathrooms and kitchens your not effecting the rest of the property.
Also the electrics are run through conduit and junction boxes spread about to access and pull wires easily.
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That's a sensible way doing it. Always get wound up about it when no isolator valves but only one stopcock in a whole house and that's seized, then you have to either freeze it, clamp it or get the waterboard to shut mains on the road if there's any
 
A.plasterer said:
All pipework is buried in the walls over here and every room where present has isolation taps so when working on bathrooms and kitchens your not effecting the rest of the property.
Also the electrics are run through conduit and junction boxes spread about to access and pull wires easily.
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Infact all toilets sinks etc have isolation taps so can be replaced simply effecting nothing else too.
"That's the way we've always done it."
Ps bathroom yet to be ripped out , so no not my work :burlas:
 
zolco said:
That's a sensible way doing it. Always get wound up about it when no isolator valves but only one stopcock in a whole house and that's seized, then you have to either freeze it, clamp it or get the waterboard to shut mains on the road if there's any
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If I went back to uk I would fit them for peace of mind.
 
zolco said:
I always do, still plumbers massively overlooking it. When you mention it to them, most will question it
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As quoted by imago trades have resistance to change no matter how much sense it makes, as with most things in life you can only make life easier for yourself (and in this case your clients) but generally speaking to brick wall with others.
 
new builds with no pipe or ducts on the oversite can just put a power float over the concrete .
on a extension the problem is the knock through it is easy to make adjustments when laying the screed.
sub floor compound is expensive.
 
malc said:
new builds with no pipe or ducts on the oversite can just put a power float over the concrete .
on a extension the problem is the knock through it is easy to make adjustments when laying the screed.
sub floor compound is expensive.
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Knock through isn't an issue TBH. Take a couple of bricks out to expose the interior level, or use a laser and set up a datum, and fifty quids worth of levelling compound. Or a grand or so and an extra day for laying screed for no other purpose than to act as a filler/packer to get the level right. I know which one is the better option.
 
A.plasterer said:
All metal stud here also on new builds double boarded and insulated no messing about with timber and movement connected.
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That's another one you rarely see on domestics or new builds, metal stud. Yet it's been around for years.
 
imago said:
Knock through isn't an issue TBH. Take a couple of bricks out to expose the interior level, or use a laser and set up a datum, and fifty quids worth of levelling compound. Or a grand or so and an extra day for laying screed for no other purpose than to act as a filler/packer to get the level right. I know which one is the better option.
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i have always troweled up the concrete at dpc level, not once the walls are built.
 
So where would you put your pipe?

Does make sense though, might try persuade a couple builders..... sweet no screed.
 
malc said:
i have always troweled up the concrete at dpc level, not once the walls are built.
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It's handy to work off of for putting in steels etc. You can still drop a couple of bricks out, one at DPC and one above to transfer the level through.

Worth mentioning though, I've stopped chiselling bricks out for that, and also for putting needles it at first floor level. I use a 4" core drill now, quicker, cleaner and it stops anything cracking or slumping above as it's a circle so preserves the strength.
 
Natwasere said:
So where would you put your pipe?

Does make sense though, might try persuade a couple builders..... sweet no screed.
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Anything in the floor on the extension I'm doing now is going into a duct in the concrete. That said, I'm going to try and avoid putting anything in the floor if there's another possible route for it.
 
imago said:
I was thinking about the screed for the extension floor, and what a pointless waste of time and money it is. Screed has it's place, and is the only solution for some jobs, but it's used way too often and unnecessarily so IMHO.

The thing that makes it redundant in a lot of cases is bagged levelling compound which provides the finish for the floor covering to go down on.

If the concrete slab is poured and levelled and trowelled correctly, then 5mm of latex leveller to take out any pimples, dimples etc it's job done. Which is what I'm going to do in the extension.

That got me thinking about all the other times we do stuff just because that's always been the way. The building game is notoriously resistant to change. Materials technology is constantly advancing, and the new stuff does get used, but it tends to be as well as rather than instead of.
Click to expand...


Concrete, heavy guage DPC, insulation, plumbing pipes then screed. Its how ive always done it and itl be staying like this untill someone pays me alot more or something different!
 
hail hail said:
Concrete, heavy guage DPC, insulation, plumbing pipes then screed. Its how ive always done it and itl be staying like this untill someone pays me alot more or something different!
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Good for you, I'll go with membrane, insulation, concrete, kettle on. Done in half the time, save the customer money, make more myself and be on to the next job sooner. (y)
 
I'll be doing things in the order of Thomas crapper , cup of tea ,some breakfast then can I be bothered to do anything on this refurb at all or just go to the beach.
How many of you have projects of your own on the go be it places to sell/investments or the place you live in?
Does the work and enthusiasm like mine get done in bursts then takes time to go at it again.
I have two bedrooms to plaster n paint and a bathroom to refit and that's the way it's been since before xmas.
I know I need to get on with it but seem to see down time from jobs as my right to rest , but getting it done and sold will free me up to do another or get my motorhome and fuk off in that for bit.
Then get into another project .
 
markyspread said:
and the underfloor heating ??? wheres that going ? because every job down my way has that now
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Underfloor heating is always going into screed on top of insulation over the slab. I'm not suggesting doing away with screed, just using it where it's appropriate rather than everywhere because "it's what we always do".
 
imago said:
Good for you, I'll go with membrane, insulation, concrete, kettle on. Done in half the time, save the customer money, make more myself and be on to the next job sooner. (y)
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You can't put concrete over pipes. Well your not supposed to because if they need seen to again, its a f**k**g nightmare breaking through it. Screed is easier to break into.
 
hail hail said:
You can't put concrete over pipes. Well your not supposed to because if they need seen to again, its a f**k**g nightmare breaking through it. Screed is easier to break into.
Click to expand...

Even when using screed I avoid pipes in the floor unless they're coming up from it anyway, they go in the walls and ceiling.
 
hail hail said:
All floors I've did have had pipes in them.
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As far as I can recall, I've only done one in the last four years that had pipes in it. There was no other route inside the building so they had to run under the floor.
 
A.plasterer said:
I'll be doing things in the order of Thomas crapper , cup of tea ,some breakfast then can I be bothered to do anything on this refurb at all or just go to the beach.
How many of you have projects of your own on the go be it places to sell/investments or the place you live in?
Does the work and enthusiasm like mine get done in bursts then takes time to go at it again.
I have two bedrooms to plaster n paint and a bathroom to refit and that's the way it's been since before xmas.
I know I need to get on with it but seem to see down time from jobs as my right to rest , but getting it done and sold will free me up to do another or get my motorhome and fuk off in that for bit.
Then get into another project .
Click to expand...
You are proper Spanish now!
:sisi:
 
imago said:
That got me thinking about all the other times we do stuff just because that's always been the way. The building game is notoriously resistant to change. Materials technology is constantly advancing, and the new stuff does get used, but it tends to be as well as rather than instead of.
Click to expand...

SKimming over tacky PVA :D
 
A.plasterer said:
I'll be doing things in the order of Thomas crapper , cup of tea ,some breakfast then can I be bothered to do anything on this refurb at all or just go to the beach.
How many of you have projects of your own on the go be it places to sell/investments or the place you live in?
Does the work and enthusiasm like mine get done in bursts then takes time to go at it again.
I have two bedrooms to plaster n paint and a bathroom to refit and that's the way it's been since before xmas.
I know I need to get on with it but seem to see down time from jobs as my right to rest , but getting it done and sold will free me up to do another or get my motorhome and fuk off in that for bit.
Then get into another project .
Click to expand...



In the boom I built a 6 bed/4bathroom house while also working. Busted my balls in with it. Now I want to make a lot of changes to it. Was supposed to take Jan off and get stuck in. Was to busy at the time so nothing done :( even bought the Tri folding door but its been sitting in the spar room since Jan collecting dust!

Also looking for a small cottage to do up. Have seen one or two interested in however they need lots of work. When I do eventually buy one, it'll be a 5 year project to get it finished and will be using as much left over or over ordered;) materials as I can get. Have already started saving up plasterboard, insulation, plumbing pipes and fittings for it. Have even got an old eirn stove and an oil burner.
 
imago said:
Good for you, I'll go with membrane, insulation, concrete, kettle on. Done in half the time, save the customer money, make more myself and be on to the next job sooner. (y)
Click to expand...

Imago for a finished floor how thick a concrete slab would you lay?.
 
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